OFCOMS Report

[#1]

Quote from: Dom

It's not the fact that Average Joe doesn't understand what makes a line slow, it's the fact that ISP's have been advertising speeds faster than they actually are. They've even been embellishing the average speeds as being faster than they actually are.

And it's not just the ISPs. My first router was a Linksys ADSL2MUE, and these are extracts from the manufacturer's blurb -

Quote

The Linksys ADSL2 Modem gives you a blazing fast connection to the Internet, far faster and more convenient than a standard dial-up.......... Web surfing and your e-mail are instantly available, anytime........... Along with instant connectivity, you'll be surfing the web at speeds you never imagined possible.......... With incoming data speeds up to 12 Mbps (depending on your service level), ADSL broadband service means no more waiting for slow downloads - even the most graphic-intensive web pages load in seconds.......... Audio and video streams play smooth and glitch-free.......... Harness the full potential of the Internet with the Linksys ADSL2 Modem.

No mention of line length, ISP capacity, or any other constraints. I didn't believe it, of course, but that's the kind of image presented to the public as broadband began to take off. Small wonder that Average Joe is disillusioned.

[#2]

Quote from: Ben

After investigating a bit further, Ofcom used a fairly rigorous 2σ to report their variances so it seems sound.

So are speeds known to be normally distributed?
i.e. "fairly rigorous 2σ" is not even slightly rigorous.

[#3]

It's a pretty standard measure to call fair limits on a normal distribution and I'd hazard a guess that broadband speeds are fairly normally distributed when the average is approximately 50% of the mean.

[#4]

Perhaps ISP's should advertise "up to 7mb" rather than 8mb. It's far more likely that someone close to the exchange would get 7 than they would 8, and for the odd few who actually got closer to 8, they'd be chuffed to bits. But at least ISP's wouldn't be advertising a potential speed that's basically impossible to obtain.

[#5]

This is why we advertise ADSL2+ as 'up to 20mbps'

[#6]

So what could it potentially go up to if the marketing department had their way? 24mbps?
Well I'm glad it's being touted as "up to 20" even if the odd person might get slightly faster. I'd rather have lower expectations and be pleasantly surprised, than be promised the world and have my hopes dashed.

[#7]

The highest profile on ADSL2+ is 21,000kbps then you have transmission overheads. Marketing made the decision to go with 20

[#8]

That's cool then.
Bring on FTTC!!
Speaking of fibre, I've heard that (although it's way faster) it still has some of the same troubles as normal copper wire, whereby the further you are from the exchange the slower the speeds you'll recieve. Is that true?

[#9]

Dom Just because you dont understand the ways ADSL work, dont blame PN
my service is published as up to 8M, see the first chart above
My sysnch to the exchange is 8128 kbs
My profile after taking off the first set of overheads is 7150
My download speeds after taking off the router and WiFi overheads varies 6000-6500, or on this laptop (and I am not worried) is about 5500
So do I get 8M - yes I synch at that

[#10]

Quote from: pierre_pierre

Dom Just because you dont understand the ways ADSL work, dont blame PN.

Wow, two massively wrong assumptions in such a short sentence. I understand how ADSL works just fine thanks, and I haven't blamed Plusnet for anything. I was simply stating my disappointment that what people get is nearly always worse that what you see advertised. Seems a fair point to me.
Also, it was you who started this thread in the first place. So if people come in here and start whining, you've only yourself to blame.

[#11]

but what are you wining about?, all the ISP's from the OFCOM chart are correct, some people can get 8M and that is what the advert says
from the PN front page http://www.plus.net/?home=hometop
1 - Broadband speed is described as up to 8Mb or 20Mb because your actual download speeds will vary depending on where you live. We'll give you a speed estimate when you sign up.

[#12]

Obvious troll is obvious.

[#13]

Having had a quick skim through the full OFCOM report, it looks like they've done the best they could with the data available, but the figures should still be treated with caution. For some reason they don't give the sample sizes for the individual packages from different suppliers (unless I've missed it). Their target was to get 100 respondents for each package, but in the end they settled for 30 as the minimum, noting where the sample size was less than 50 (AOL and Orange in the graph at tthe start of the thread). Given that Plusnet isn't as large as some of the others, it's probable that the sample was nearer 50 than 100, but we just don't know.
There was a lot of weighting done for various factors (e.g. market 1 exchanges were excluded, and weighting was done to allow for differences in 'straight-line' distances from the exchange between users of different packages). It all looks legitimate, but it would be good to repeat the exercise with larger sample sizes. I think the entire sample was recruited by people volunteering after seeing an announcement on the Samknows website (correct me if I'm wrong) and this might introduce some bias, but there's no reason to think the bias would have favoured one supplier over others.
Note that no Plusnet customers on ADSL2+ were included in the package comparison. As Plusnet offered ADSL2+ a bit earlier than some other suppliers, it may be that proportionately more Plusnet customers with faster connections would have migrated to ADSL2+ by the time the data were collected. But that's by no means certain.
What is absolutely clear is that cable outperforms DSL in getting closer to advertised 'up to' speeds. But there are well-known technical reasons for that.
One reason I didn't take part in the exercise after I read about it was that the uploads/downloads for the data collection use a fair bit of bandwidth per month (2GB, I think, though some of it's at night). Not a big problem for people on Extra, but for people on Value it could take a significant chunk of their allowance. Nevertheless, if Plusnet want to ensure that there's a more representative sample in future it could be good to publicise the project and tell customers how to become part of it:
http://www.samknows.com/broadband/ofcom_and_samknows
Graham

[#14]

@Grahamt
You are correct on the SamKnows requiements
They asked for volunteers, the questions asked, who is your ASP, what is your advertised speed, do you know it takes 2G and you have to leave it on 24 hrs.
As I an on Value 8M only possible,  My normal use is about 4G so I could afford the 2G
They supply a modified netgear that is connected to your router via ethernet, that does the analysis which it sends home,, you get acces via an HTTPS link to your own results
@Dom, where is the Troll?
from Forum Rules

Quote

Trolling A troll is a person who posts inflammatory messages, to disrupt the discussion or to upset its participants. The word, or its derivative, "trolling", is also used to describe such messages or the act of posting them. This behaviour will not be tolerated.

[#15]

@Dom
In FTTC, copper runs from the cabinet to your house, it is this distance that determines your speed. I just placed an order for a customer who is moving from 2.5Mbps on ADSL2+ to an estimated 35.1Mbps on FTTC because they're a long distance from the exchange but not from the cabinet.