Router keeps disconnecting WAN

[#1]

Hi,

Can someone from PN please look at Question 147459886 and help me to get this sorted once and for all?  

Background:

I have been having frequent but irregular WAN drops for years.  Every now and then, it gets so bad I raise a fault and BT eventually make it bearable so I go quiet for a bit.

I'm back at the unbearable at the moment and this ticket has been open since April.  Plus.net just keep sending BT who say everything is fine when they get here.  They agree the line seems "poor" but with no spare pairs they never actually do anything but test and go away again.

Symptoms:

All I know is that my Draytek reports downstream SNR of 0db when it seems to drop.  When it comes back after a few minutes, I notice one of 3 things:

1) Everything is OK and up and down SNR are back at 9db.  Down is back at 66Mbits (banded apparently due to instability).

2) Or, down SNR is still < 6db and so my synch speed is about 20Mbits.

3) Everything is not right and router needs a reboot.  Dyndns update failed, "WAN IP not present".

I've had BT look for REIN and found nothing.  I've disconnected my extensions etc.  I', at the master and have tried a MK3 and MK4 master with inbuilt filter.  I have replaced RG11 cable with an adsl nation one.  I've turned off wi-fi on the Draytek, ensured settings like accelleartion are off.  I've looked at IGMP snooping and uPnP etc (I have Sonos systems).  I've been in contact with Draytek UK and tried multiple setting tweaks and new firmwares/modem codes.

I'm on plus.net unlimited fibre FTTC 80/20.  I'm using a Draytek Vigor 2860 Vac.  I've tried going back to openreach VDSL modem and plus.net router and although slighly better, it still drops.  I was on a 2850 before this with similar results.

Thanks,

Si.

[#2]

Currently I have been WAN connected for a couple of hrs (2hrs 40) and the down SNR is already down to 5db from 8db.

(Not sure why my router seems to struggle to identify the vendor under ATU-R sometimes):

ATU-R Information
	Type:	VDSL2
	Hardware:	Annex A
	Firmware:	05-07-06-0D-01-07
	Power Mngt Mode:	DSL_G997_PMS_L0
	Line State:	SHOWTIME
	Running Mode:	17A
	Vendor ID:	00000000 00000000
ATU-C Information
	Vendor ID:	b5004244 434da48c [BDCM]
Line Statistics
	Downstream             Upstream                 Actual Rate 66997 Kbps 19999 Kbps Attainable Rate 62282 Kbps 28306 Kbps Path Mode Fast Fast Interleave Depth 1 1 Actual PSD 5. 5 dB 12. 9 dB       Near End                  Far End                    Trellis ON ON Bitswap ON ON ReTx 1   1   SNR Margin 5 dB 10 dB Attenuation 13 dB 15 dB CRC 0 172 FECS 0 s 56390 s ES 0 s 29 s SES 0 s 3 s LOSS 0 s 3 s UAS 27 s 3488 s HEC Errors 0 0 RS Corrections 0 0 LOS Failure 2 0 LOF Failure 0 0 LPR Failure 0 2 NCD Failure 0 0 LCD Failure 0 0 NFEC 32 32 RFEC 16 16 LYSMB 16 16

[#3]

Hi Si,

I am sorry to hear you're having connection problems.

Testing your broadband service is showing your router in sync at 66.9mbps which is within your estimates. Line tests aren't pointing towards any issues.

I can see your connection is dropping occasionally and at the moment, I don't think it's intermittent enough to arrange another engineer, because it's likely that they'll find no fault again.

Our faults team should pick up your ticket within the next couple of days and if the drops continue it's likely we'll need to book another engineer visit to investigate this.

[#4]

Thanks - it got worse again and another engineer did come out.  He suspects SHINE and pretty much said it's almost impossible to find.  Great!  He also suggested the only other thing might be to use a non vector firmware on the Draytek 2860.  He could see that I have tried different routers, tried to ensure no interference myself, changed cables, power supplies, looked for REIN myself etc.

But since then the portal now says that "after testing we (you) have identified an external fault but no appointment is required".

May I ask if you clarify what this means?  Do I stop trying things my end?  What is going on please?

Thanks

[#5]

Sorry about that response. It looks like the adviser used the wrong stock ticket - that means that a fault has been identified that doesn't require access to your property. Having said that, from the testing they've done, a fault has not been identified.

I'll pass feedback on to their manager in regards to that.

I've tested your line just now.

Apart from the drops I'm seeing and your router in sync at a speed below your estimates, I'm not identifying the cause of that. From reading the engineer notes, that seems to indicate a problem with the Draytek router you're using?

Mind plugging the Openreach Modem/Plusnet router back in and we'll re-test?

Anoush

[#6]

Thanks for the reply.  Oh that explains it then.  Thanks for the explanation on that.

As per your own staff comments, my line is "banded" due to all the drops.  Whatever modem I put on will do the same speed wise at least.

By the way, I tested a different modem after the BTOR engineer left and drops continued in exactly the same way.  My current "line speed" (used to be called profile I believe) is 50.8 from https://www.plus.net/my.html?action=data_transfer_speed.  No line reset has been performed/requested - probably due to stability issues.

So, the only other thing he could suggest (if not a SHINE issue) was vectoring process was causing it (vectoring was causing the SNR to goto zero db).  Draytek do not agree and have requested I do NOT change the firmware.  I have a 2860Vac (currently connected as modem and router) and a Draytek Vigor 130 modem as a backup.  The last time I tried the BT OR modem it still dropped.  This is all documented on the rather long ticket.

But yes, I can try the BT OR modem (does it even support vectoring???) and Technicolor TG582n plus.net router (but it's so bad, I need to swap back to Draytek ASAP for firewall rules, VOIP and static LAN IP address binds). If I do this after 5pm can you test or is it best to leave until the morning?

[#7]

---

@slime-uk wrote:
As per your own staff comments, my line is "banded" due to all the drops.  Whatever modem I put on will do the same speed wise at least.

The banding is set at

Profile Name

0.128M-67M Downstream, Retransmission Low - 0.128M-20M Upstream, Error Protection Off

but as your sync rate is considerably lower, I don't think the banding will be the cause of that.

---

@slime-uk wrote:
By the way, I tested a different modem after the BTOR engineer left and drops continued in exactly the same way.  My current "line speed" (used to be called profile I believe) is 50.8 from https://www.plus.net/my.html?action=data_transfer_speed.  No line reset has been performed/requested - probably due to stability issues.

I've just bumped the connection profile now to match the current sync rate. It can sometimes be a bit slow to automatically adjust, apologies for that.

---

@slime-uk wrote:

So, the only other thing he could suggest (if not a SHINE issue) was vectoring process was causing it (vectoring was causing the SNR to goto zero db).  Draytek do not agree and have requested I do NOT change the firmware.  I have a 2860Vac (currently connected as modem and router) and a Draytek Vigor 130 modem as a backup.  The last time I tried the BT OR modem it still dropped.  This is all documented on the rather long ticket.

But yes, I can try the BT OR modem (does it even support vectoring???) and Technicolor TG582n plus.net router (but it's so bad, I need to swap back to Draytek ASAP for firewall rules, VOIP and static LAN IP address binds). If I do this after 5pm can you test or is it best to leave until the morning?

---

I'm not aware that it supports vectoring. Sorry to ask you to do something you've done before. If you can setup the OR modem/Plusnet router overnight we can check back on the connection tomorrow just to double check it's still dropping.

If that's the case, we'd need to arrange another engineer visit. Something else I'm going to ask which you've probably done; have you tried the test socket?

Anoush

[#8]

Thanks - Well it was rock steady at 10db SNR down and 10db up since Monday night (with about 60Mbps down and 19,999Kbps up) when I dropped the WAN myself just now.  I just dropped it now to move over to the Technicolor and OpenReach modem but one final test first in the Draytek and it was only synching at 20 odd Mbps and like I say 6db SNR down and 10db up. My bit bin graph again showed all higher frequency on the downsteam completely missing after this drop.  I feel that this line is very poor - maybe a bad joint or something but after 4 engineer visits, does anyone check the obvious - no - it seems not.  I would myself but I guess I shouldn't go into the BT pits or climb their poles etc!!!  So, alas I wait.

Anyway - as you requested, I'm currently connected with an old Technicolor TG thingy and the BT OR modem.  Please test ASAP as I can't leave this router connected for long as it's pretty awful!

Also - to answer your questions...yes I have tried at the master test socket.  Yes all my extension wiring is currently disconnected.  I have tried new VDSL RG11 cables, new power supplies, looking for REIN on 612KHz with a radio, disconnecting every network device, disconnecting close by power cables, putting Draytek back to factory settings and not enabling too  much, reducing my uploads as some folk have a few issues when they upload a fair bit on the 2860 it seems, lots of different firmware versions for the Draytrek.  The only thing I have not tried really is checking all joints on the BT wire but that is not for me to do.

Anyway - the BT OR modem and plus.net router is waiting for you to run a test.  Thanks for the help.

Thanks,

Si.

[#9]

Thanks Si

Though it doesn't look like there's a PPP session

And there isn't any sync for that matter

Sync Status	Out Of Sync
Downstream Speed	57.4 Mbps
Upstream Speed	19.1 Mbps

Is your modem still plugged in? Having said that, the speed is still below your estimates so the next step is likely to be another engineer visit to investigate further.

[#10]

Sorry - there was or rather should have been.  The graph shows me disconnecting and swapping back to the Plus.net equipment at about 9PM ish on Wednesday 19th.  But it all went off the next day at about 10am when BT OpenReach turned up for another job I had booked in - a new phone line with a different provider.  Ironic, but the route they (and I) wanted to take for this new 2nd line was more direct than my existing (plus.net) provided line but the neighbor came out not happy about the new proposed route (over their garden) so we compromised (grrrr) and now I have a new cable from the pole to my house where 2 lines are running down said new cable.  Since they left, I am at 100+ hrs uptime for the first time in years.  Early days but so far so good.  Shame it's cost me over £700 but let's see how it goes....