landlines are being fazed out

[#1]

@JSHarris 

"PSTN exchanges had massive 50V battery banks, that could keep the phones working for a long time (I think several days) in the event of power failure."

Strictly speaking, I think that the 50 volt batteries were spec'd to keep the exchange going for just a few hours, it was the diesel generators that can keep them going for days - though it is nearly 40 years since I worked in a telephone exchange.

"It seems probable that cabinet batteries may only be designed to keep things going for short glitches in the mains supply, rather than power cuts lasting hours."

I have been advised on other forums that the batteries were originally spec'd to run the cabinets for 30 minutes. But with aging, some people have reported them failing after 20 minutes or so. I think that Openreach has a battery maintenance/replacement schedule?

[#2]

@JSHarris 

With regard to your mother. Couple of things to check.

Use the Checker to see what's available at your mothers address.

Check out the Fall Alarm - it may or may not work with VOIP.

You would need some sort of power back up.

Brian

[#3]

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@Mr_Paul wrote:

@JSHarris 

"PSTN exchanges had massive 50V battery banks, that could keep the phones working for a long time (I think several days) in the event of power failure."

Strictly speaking, I think that the 50 volt batteries were spec'd to keep the exchange going for just a few hours, it was the diesel generators that can keep them going for days - though it is nearly 40 years since I worked in a telephone exchange.

"It seems probable that cabinet batteries may only be designed to keep things going for short glitches in the mains supply, rather than power cuts lasting hours."

I have been advised on other forums that the batteries were originally spec'd to run the cabinets for 30 minutes. But with aging, some people have reported them failing after 20 minutes or so. I think that Openreach has a battery maintenance/replacement schedule?

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That matches our experience.  Our cabinet regularly falls over after about 20 minutes without power.  The battery in it does get stressed a fair bit, as we get quite a few power cuts in winter, often lasting for anything from a few hours to a couple of days.  We usually get compensation for the longer ones, but that doesn't seem to be a strong enough incentive to get the DNO to make the local distribution network more robust.

It does beg the question as to whether half an hour of emergency power is of any practical use in rural areas.  That's longer than it would take to get an ambulance or fire engine to us for sure.    To be of use during a typical winter power outage the cabinets really need to stay alive for around 8 hours as a minimum.

[#4]

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@bmc wrote:

@JSHarris 

With regard to your mother. Couple of things to check.

Use the Checker to see what's available at your mothers address.

Check out the Fall Alarm - it may or may not work with VOIP.

You would need some sort of power back up.

Brian

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Thanks, already done.  My plan is to try and get her (my mother in law) to switch to BT.  All the research I've done suggests that BT have the best off-the-shelf solutions that will provide her with a phone and connection for her fall alarm.  My brother in law may well look after things, as he's closer to his mother than we are. 

[#5]

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@JSHarris wrote:

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We don't really use our mobiles much (no point when the signal locally is very poor) so we both have PAYG SIMs.  These don't allow WiFi calling, but as @Anonymous says, WiFi calling is not a lot of use when the FTTC cabinet battery runs flat after about 20 minutes.

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There are PAYG services readily available which allow WiFi calling.

More often the limitation(s) are, either that of the particular VMNO mobile provider, or limitation of particular phone's specification.

This Wikipedia table is quite a useful reference, re various UK VMNO mobile providers and their individual capabilities...

List of United Kingdom mobile virtual network operators - Wikipedia

FWIW - I currently use a very low cost PAYG tariff from 1p Mobile, who use the EE network (BT Group) - '1p Mobile' provide 4G, 5G service with WiFi calling capability on all tariffs, PAYG/bundles, etc (your phone has to have WiFi calling capability/enabled).

Mobile signal isn't great here - but it's 'tolerable'.

[#6]

@JSHarris  From my browsing on various Broadband forum sites I was under the impression that FTTC cabinet battery support was expected to last for around 8 hours which is considerably more than 20 minutes, which seems ridiculously short. However over time the batteries will degrade so should be replaced, knowing Openreach that probably isn't happening.☹️ 

[#7]

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@Mark280 wrote:

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@JSHarris wrote:

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We don't really use our mobiles much (no point when the signal locally is very poor) so we both have PAYG SIMs.  These don't allow WiFi calling, but as @Anonymous says, WiFi calling is not a lot of use when the FTTC cabinet battery runs flat after about 20 minutes.

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There are PAYG services readily available which allow WiFi calling.

More often the limitation(s) are, either that of the particular VMNO mobile provider, or limitation of particular phone's specification.

This Wikipedia table is quite a useful reference, re various UK VMNO mobile providers and their individual capabilities...

List of United Kingdom mobile virtual network operators - Wikipedia

FWIW - I currently use a very low cost PAYG tariff from 1p Mobile, who use the EE network (BT Group) - '1p Mobile' provide 4G, 5G service with WiFi calling capability on all tariffs, PAYG/bundles, etc (your phone has to have WiFi calling capability/enabled).

Mobile signal isn't great here - but it's 'tolerable'.

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There are, but we need a provider that uses O2, specifically cell 12 in the 800MHz band, from our local mast, as that's the only coverage.  EE use the 1800MHz band in the main and that's hopeless in rural areas, as it doesn't follow hilly terrain at all well.  We did look around but no one offers a PAYG that works on that specific cell frequency and has WiFi calling. 

As previously mentioned, WiFi calling is only a very marginal benefit, as the local cabinet falls over after about 20 minutes without power.  A typical power cut here lasts between 4 and 8 hours, just because it takes ages for them to get out here to fix things.  The big advantage of getting VOIP via the 4G gateway (with it's large antennas) is that the mast power seems to have a good backup power system from what I've been told, so as long as we can maintain power our end we should be able to make an emergency call if needed.

[#8]

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@RealAleMadrid wrote:

@JSHarris  From my browsing on various Broadband forum sites I was under the impression that FTTC cabinet battery support was expected to last for around 8 hours which is considerably more than 20 minutes, which seems ridiculously short. However over time the batteries will degrade so should be replaced, knowing Openreach that probably isn't happening.☹️ 

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Be good if they did last 8 hours!

Ours never has, right from the time it was installed.  I installed a UPS and big battery backup system when I built the house, thinking that I could keep broadband and lights etc running during a power cut, only to find that the cabinet always fails after about 20 minutes.

[#9]

It seems to me that PlusNet have confused things by sending out routers which are ready for IP Telephony and then not implementing it. Perhaps they were just keeping options open. I have FTTC, which is the only option in my street. My PlusNet contract ends next month and the options I have from PlusNet are renew with FTTC at the same price or switch to a SOGEA line, which is cheaper. There is no great financial benefit to switching to another CP and I think the OR rule is that I will be switched to SOGEA if I change CP and I don't want to loose the phone line and number. (I am in an OR Stop Sell area for PSTN lines, already). Unless a good offer pops up in the next few weeks, I'm thinking of just remaining on PlusNet FTTC and waiting to see what BT Group decide to do. My contract will then end in 2025, if PlusNet survives that long. IP Telephony, in whatever form, should be working well by then and the change should be easy for me. I've got no unusual equipment and no extension wiring. It appears to me that there is minimal difference between the PN and BT Hub2s and BT could take on PN customers with just a configuration change, if they chose that option.