is Plusnet keeping up todate with legislation?

[#1]

But not flash cookies as they don't ask it  just installs them
If you are using Firefox the Better Privacy addon stops them

[#2]

Thanks for the tip, Jim!
I hadn't heard about Better Privacy.

[#3]

Here's another thread where I got drawn in to the contentious issue, and then ended up throwing away most of what I wrote, because I realised I can't be bothered to prolong the argument with someone who is in "write-only" mode.
However, I did go looking for more details of that  Ofcom consultation on net neutrality & traffic management. Ofcom themselves state:

Quote

We believe the potential anti-competitive effect of discriminatory traffic management policies may be a valid concern and relevant for consideration as part of our general duty to promote competition. ... Generally speaking, our initial position is that discriminatory behaviour is only a potential issue where firms have substantial 'market power' and could discriminate in favour of their own services. In this case, any form of discrimination will come under very close scrutiny to ensure that there are no anti-competitive effects. We believe that there is insufficient evidence at present to justify the setting of blanket restrictions on all forms of traffic management.

Given that the "Pro" package allows all protocols, at line speeds, to all content providers without any discrimination, I fail to see where it allows for bias in Plusnet's favour. How does "Pro" cause Ofcom to be unhappy?
Even worse... BT's response to the consultation specifically points out the "Plusnet Pro" package as "for downloads, gaming, music and more…. “All traffic prioritised at all times”." If Ofcom is expressing a lack of amusement, I suspect it might not have been aimed at the product.
I also went looking at some of the other responses. In general, ISPs take a pragmatic view on what they actually need to do to be able to build & run a network economically - and that this is based on similar practical realities that Telco's face. Kcom's response has a nice quote about how voice networks have been dimensioned over the years:

Quote

It is probably not well understood by consumers that this results in [voice] networks that are engineered not to be able to support calls from all connected customers at the same time – indeed, in many instances, if all customers tried to make simultaneous calls, some would not even receive “dial tone”.

It isn't surprising that their general response it thus:

Quote

However, we do think that it is key to view the issues from a position that is informed both by the actual needs of users, and a clear perspective on the reality of ISP networks, rather than an idealised view of “internet principles” that owes little or nothing to how consumer oriented network services have evolved. ... Traffic Management is Net Neutrality Given the actual nature of ISP network economics, it can be argued that judicious use of traffic management practices is essential to maintaining the “essential principle” of net neutrality – namely that end users are free to use the applications of their choice, without the worry that the behaviour of others will adversely affect their ability to do so.

I don't detect any indication that Ofcom have any desire to stop the use of traffic management per se, nor to prevent its use to give fair access in congested networks. All emphasis seem to be for transparency, and to avoid anti-competitive behaviour. Yet no-one has any evidence to show any such behaviour at present. Not even "Which?" - although they do complain about Orange & Vodafone for removing VoIP from Nokia handsets.

[#4]

With a good mix of sound reasoning mixed with appropriate OFCOM references it may be worthwhile giving this post a minor rewrite into a format suitable to include in the Community Support Library.    It would make for a nice easy reference next time this Topic appears?

Maurice

[#5]

Despite the lucid response from wombat I am unsure that he has grasped the essence of my concern

I, like many thousands of users dislike traffic management , but i accept that in the interests of net neutrality, such policies may be essential inorder to ensure fair play for all users .
However the new plus prod add on would allow those fortunate enough to afford another payment, to avoid the traffic management  and obtain line speed at all times.
This  destroys the whole argument of net neutrality and the raison-detre behind traffic management policies.
To repeat  the aetiology of this post..........net neutrality is a principle that prevents isp,s from offering a superior service to customers who pay extra.
The new plusnet product  destroys the principle of net neutrality.
I accept that "money" talks and  that in our society people are used to jumping the system be it education or private medical care.
But what i esentially find hard to swallow is plus net on the one hand arguing the case for traffic management and then on the othe rhand appearing to demolish that principle by allowing the well heeled customers to by pass such restrictions.
Apart from looking like the hand of a hypocrite, Plus net are in danger of becoming little more than a rent boy  to those who have money to throw around.
Either plusnet should stick to the inherent principle of net neutrality or abandon any such pretence.
An ISP which has one policy for some customers and another policy for other customers will most certainly arouse the wrath of Ofcom
through the disquiet expressed by users to them, and i already have an assurance from Ofcom that they will take a long hard look at Plusnet's add on product.
I am equally surprized that todate no senior member of Plusnet management has  commented on this post.Perhaphs they do not realise
the ramnifications of the post.

[#6]

@thisoldman
I believe that you may be misinterpreting some of the essence of 'net neutrality'?
I support the Ofcom stance that Traffic Management (in its broadest sense) is not in itself a barrier to Net Neutrality unless it is used to unfairly discriminate for / against classes of service for commercial advantage.  The Plusnet packages do not differentiate in this way (at least as far as published details allow comment).
Yes, you can elect to buy a faster connection; consume more bandwidth for a price  - what you cannot do (though many believe they should) is to pay for a low speed connection and sit eating all you can for 24 hours a day for ~ £7

[#7]

thanks for your post maurice. i do not believe i am misinterpreting the  argument.
I repeat for the last time        traffic management  allows fairness to all users.  To allow people to bypass traffic management by paying extra
defeats the whole argument in favour of having traffic management policies in the first place.
This is not about packages or usage its about bypassing traffic management.
Lets assume 50% of all plusnet users pay the extra fiver to by pass the traffic management.
1 how would the network cope
2 would more severe traffic management policies need to be introduced to rective the balance
3 if the network has the capacity to allow  unlimited number of users to bypass traffic management, why do we then have traffic management policies at all?

[#8]

Sorry @thisoldman you have not got a clue about the difference between traffic management and net neutrality.
Traffic management = Is by ISP to allow fair sharing of bandwidth to end users. End users can pay more not be subject to traffic management. If bandwidth then become a problem then the ISP have to buy more.
Net Neutrality = Is to stop services paying ISP's to have preferential treatment over their network.

[#9]

I'll come back with a full answer later today, but I just wanted to add this now...
The term "Net Neutrality" means a lot of different things to different people - from those who want to follow the original principles of the internet (everything is supplied on a "best effort" basis, and fights equally) who believe in NO traffic management, through those who believe in traffic management for the sake of fairness (but who often have different definitions of "fair"), to those who believe that traffic management should also police for things such as legal content.
I think @thisoldman sits at a different position on the NN spectrum from the others in this thread, and on how the market can offer a variety of products while still being neutral, but no position is invalid. In fact - that is the whole point of the Ofcom consultation - to find out what various people & organisations believe to be the right stance on traffic management, and the right principles to take on Net Neutrality. And the range of responses show a matching spectrum.
I don't think this thread will get anwhere by telling people that their stance on NN or TM is right or wrong (so I've mellowed since I first started my original answer!), simply because there is no one definition of either NN or TM. But it is certainly useful to understand *why* they have that opinion, and to offer counter-opinions.
I'll come back later with some specific opinions & counter-opinions... 

[#10]

@thisoldman
Here is the list of examples where Plusnet positively discriminates the service from one organisation over the equivalent service from another another organisation across ALL Plusnet packages:



---
Can you see any I've missed off?
If that list is complete it confirms that Plusnet's service is net neutral.

[#11]

You missed one - BT Speedtest 

[#12]

Services supplied from CDN's

[#13]

Need more information. You are saying that data from some CDN's is faster than other CDN's - we need the names of the two networks.

[#14]

Quote from: thisoldman

I have just noticed that plusnet is offering , for a small monthly fee a new product will guarantee line speed at all times.

The penny hasn't clicked yet. What is this new product for a small monthly fee that PN is offering?
It can't be FTTC because rather, than being a small increase, it would triple my monthly fee!
I really believe that the OP has misunderstood net neutrality and OfCom's stance on it.  I've been following the argument for years and I see no way that PN need be worried.

[#15]

Quote from: Heloman

The penny hasn't clicked yet. What is this new product for a small monthly fee that PN is offering?

The Pro add-on which can be added to any of the current products.