Autumn Price increase FAQ's

[#1]

I think you've got your argument the wrong way round?
Someone who's out of contract for BB but is part way through an LRS contract is not disadvantaged by this price rise.  The price hike only affects their renewal price and they are free to terminate their BB service along with telephony as per the standard notice terms when the LRS runs out.
It's people who are in contract for BB that are disadvantaged, if their BB contract extends beyond the renewal date for LRS, as they will be faced with the choice of renewing LRS at a higher rate, or paying the increased monthly line rental but will be unable to terminate the BB early without penalty.

[#2]

Hence my suggestion in reply #102.
However if you have signed up for Line Rental Saver and then see a better offer for broadband and phone services (as most good offers are) then you might find yourself wanting to leave but being prevented because you will lose money on the LRS even though your broadband is not in a contract.  That's the whole point of LRS; it's cheaper because it binds you in.

[#3]

Quote from: Richchad

Quote from: lucerne Compared to BT what information concerning calls made etc is available from the bills? Not a lot...Call destination, Time of call, Call length, Price. Cannot save name details to any number and no pdf download option.

In what form is it produced? Can it be printed to PDF, or copied/pasted, or saved as xls/csv file?

[#4]

Home phone info is very basic and just an HTML page with headings for call destination, time of call, length of call rounded up to next minute and cost. No fancy pie charts or downloading PDF etc. Long overdue an update if you ask me especially taking more for the service.

[#5]

Quote from: ReedRichards

Plusnet are by no means the only telephone service provider to offer a Line Rental Saver that is non-refundable.  And is it fair for Plusnet to relent and offer a refund to somebody terminating a fixed-term contract when that refund option is not available to other customers who are not on a contract?

we talking about plusnet not other providers tho, but yeah they all fall foul of the regulations.
I have to keep repeating this on forums as people seem not very legally competant, legislation overules contracts and if multiple competitors do it, it doesnt make it ok.

[#6]

Quote from: pwatson

I think you've got your argument the wrong way round? Someone who's out of contract for BB but is part way through an LRS contract is not disadvantaged by this price rise.  The price hike only affects their renewal price and they are free to terminate their BB service along with telephony as per the standard notice terms when the LRS runs out. It's people who are in contract for BB that are disadvantaged, if their BB contract extends beyond the renewal date for LRS, as they will be faced with the choice of renewing LRS at a higher rate, or paying the increased monthly line rental but will be unable to terminate the BB early without penalty.

call rate changes still affect and thats part of the voice service, your point would be valid if it was only a line rental change and the line rental saver expired same time as contract, however LRS is 12 months whilst contract is 18 months meaning the customer still has 6 months of increased line rental as well.
So in laymens terms.
The customer has to cancel within 30 days to opt out, or they agree to changes.
Plusnet state they wont refund LRS if cancelled during the LRS period.  So LRS is effectively a increased cancellation charge in this case.
If the customer waits until LRS has expired, they may no longer be within the 30 days penalty free opt out.
Summary - plusnet's t&c offers no penalty free exit in the above scenario and is in breach of the regulations.  The only way they can be compliant to LRS customers who's LRS lasts longer than the 30 days is to refund unused LRS on opt out.

[#7]

Quote from: chrcoluk

if multiple competitors do it, it doesnt make it ok.

I was actually thinking that if BT, which I think is the UK ISP with the largest number of clients, offers a non-refundable Line Rental Saver that can be legally challenged then it was more likely that this had been done already and a legal judgement (or an Ofcom ruling) already established - that would apply equally to Plusnet.

[#8]

most people dont care enough to bother, and its entirely plausible those who have bothered to complain got a refund handled privately.

[#9]

Quote from: chrcoluk

my legal opinion is it doesnt seem clear cut. legislation from ofcom states these changes plusnet have to allow a penalty free cancellation.  But plusnet's t&c conflict stating LRS is non refundable. Based on my experience of other sales contracts my opinion is the legislation overules the t&c and LRS should be refundable if a customer wants to leave.  But plusnet it seems will fight such a request.  My opinon is based on the fact that witholding LRS is a penalty.

This is not correct.
LRS is a 12 month contract - irrespective of what broadband contract you take. Plusnet are not changing your 12 month contract, so there is no material detriment with regards to your existing LRS.
The price changes of 10 June 2014 would have affected any existing LRS customers who's 12 month contracts expired on or after this date, because they would have been put on a new monthly rolling contract at the new pricing (unless they had already re-subscribed to LRS at the previous pricing).
There is also no minimum contract term with LRS. If you want to leave after one one month, you can. However, the upfront payment for LRS is non-refundable. So Ofcom General Conditions Regulation 9.6 would not apply, because there is no penalty applied when leaving early with LRS (an upfront payment cannot be a penalty).

[#10]

We will have to agree to disagree, using LRS is getting a discount in return for a heavy cancellation penalty.  That penalty been that the upfront payment is not refundable.
I dont know what happened to you when you signed up but I certianly was not put on a 12month contract with my LRS, I am on a 18month voice contract with 12 months of that paid up front.

[#11]

So what happens for you after 12 months? What price do you pay for line rental after LRS finishes?

[#12]

the one quoted at the time

[#13]

Quote from: chrcoluk

I dont know what happened to you when you signed up but I certianly was not put on a 12month contract with my LRS, I am on a 18month voice contract with 12 months of that paid up front.

You sure it is an 18 month on the phone, I thought they were all 30 day rolling, only the BB is 12/18/24 months.

[#14]

You can complain to Ofcom about PN putting you on a 18 month contract (unless you requested it):

Quote

Communications Providers shall ensure that Users are able to subscribe to a contract with a maximum duration of 12 months.

Quote from: chrcoluk

We will have to agree to disagree, using LRS is getting a discount in return for a heavy cancellation penalty.  That penalty been that the upfront payment is not refundable.

But there is no cancellation penalty as there is no minimum contract. LRS requires an upfront fee, but that cannot be called a penalty.

[#15]

Remembering the days when a year after taking on the internet dial up service with BT back in the early noughties - they gave you £2.50 a month of the then £14.99 a month charge.  Nowadays discounts seem few and far between, grudgingly given and then quickly taken away again by some other price rise somewhere else.
The biggest irony is that there are now probably fewer people dealing with the technology to pay than there probably was 14 years ago!