SoGEA or Full Fibre?

[#1]

@plusmouse Don't worry about long ethernet runs in a domestic dwelling, it's designed to run AT LEAST one hundred metres!

And if you do live in an enormous property, or have an outhouse some distance away, hubs/switches solve your problem.

[#2]

So, I`ve had a text today from PN that my current contract is up soon and to consider my options. I do have until mid October and I haven`t called them yet and realize I`ve two options, but FTTP seems to be the way forward from here as we have been discussing in this thread. 

Looking again at my account, I`m paying £28.05p a month currently for FTTC 38/40. My renewal offer is the same FTTC but is 6p cheaper for another 18 month contract. Which of course may or may not run that long if the PTSN becomes an issue mid way though! So that`s the unknown...

The FF options below this show that the cheapest FF I can take is £26.99p a month on a 24 month contract....But....over those two years I will have the 2 x £3.00 March increases, which will mean at the end of the contract, the price will be £32.99p. But that`s what everyone ends up paying so we have to accept that.

The speeds that my 38/40 give me have been adequate, so although FF offers greater speed and resistance to interference, I`m scratching my head and wondering where the savings are if the phone line is being removed? It seems the pricing is going to be much the same regardless of whether I retain the phone line or not? Maybe I`m just way behind all this and expected a drop in the BB price when the landline was no longer part of the package, but as it is, that`s not the case.

I spotted a few BT Openreach guys in one of our neighbor`s gardens the other day messing about with their wires but it was chucking it down with rain and I wanted a word with one of them to ask if our address was FF priority and I missed my chance as the van drove off before I could nab a word! But I do see those `black boxes` jutting out from the telephone poles with wires coming from them and I suspect some of the houses around me are switching over too, but can`t be sure unless I speak to them directly. But I`ll try and get a word with them when I can just to get some feedback.

[#3]

@plusmouse 

You will get a far more reliable answer by using the link referenced here https://community.plus.net/t5/Home-Phone/SoGEA-or-Full-Fibre/m-p/1982957#M39916 than talking to installers.

[#4]

@plusmouse If your telegraph poles have CBT's (black boxes) on them, then , as you found at post #18, you can get Full Fibre.

The fact that the prices do not appear to come down is because the technology involved with FF is  new, so costs OR more, and they need to recover those costs in what they charge ISPs, who will pass that cost on to their customers.

As advised, if you can get FF - do so.

[#5]

@plusmouse 

If I understand correctly the £3.00 price increase applies to all new contracts so it doesn't matter whether it's SOGEA or Full Fibre.

This is a u/g 8 port CBT which is similar to those hanging from poles. If I were able to get a picture today there would be 7 cables attached which is all the houses this chamber serves.

If you look at the CBT's on poles then any cable attached means someone is getting full fibre. Another way of being nosey is to use the address version of the Checker and select surrounding address from the list. It'll say if there's on ONT listed for the property.

Brian

[#6]

Yup. Looks like I`ll be hitting the FF button next, thanks everyone for your valued input. 👍

@bmc : Thanks for explaining that image and yes, the black boxes I mentioned are definitely new additions to those 2 telegraph poles and I can see some wiring extending from them, so my surrounding neighbors do seem to be already connected. I know the woman next door is with Talk Talk but the other side have had BT people coming and going recently so I suspect they have also been `connected up` to FF. 

I have the FF/74mb option open to me but I`ll ring PN anyway just to confirm things and when I need to have the ONT box installed and set up. I already have the HUB 2 router so not sure if that`s just going to configure itself or if the Openreach person can twiddle that for me? Routers are not my best subject...

I have one more payment (or it may be 2?) until my current contract ends and I`d like any new contract to begin the day after the old one ends, but I know you guys have told me that I don`t have to wait and can just agree a new FF contract now if I want to. I just worry about the old/new pricing getting messed up. Essentially, I`d be leaving a contract early but because I`m already with PN I don`t think that would matter? 

[#7]

I already have the HUB 2 router so not sure if that`s just going to configure itself or if the Openreach person can twiddle that for me?

You'll just need to disconnect the DSL cable that currently goes to your master socket, and then connect an ethernet cable from the ONT to the red WAN port. The Hub2 will then configure itself.

[#8]

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@plusmouse wrote:

Yup. Looks like I`ll be hitting the FF button next, thanks everyone for your valued input. 👍

I have the FF/74mb option open to me but I`ll ring PN anyway just to confirm things and when I need to have the ONT box installed and set up. I already have the HUB 2 router so not sure if that`s just going to configure itself or if the Openreach person can twiddle that for me? Routers are not my best subject...

I have one more payment (or it may be 2?) until my current contract ends and I`d like any new contract to begin the day after the old one ends, but I know you guys have told me that I don`t have to wait and can just agree a new FF contract now if I want to. I just worry about the old/new pricing getting messed up. Essentially, I`d be leaving a contract early but because I`m already with PN I don`t think that would matter? 

---

The only 'change' to your Hub2 will be replacing the current grey DSL cable with a Ethernet  one - which will go into the red port on your Hub and the relevant one in the ONT - a job the installer will do for you.

Unfortunately, the contract change date cannot be done to suit you, as when the installation of FF will happen is dependent on engineer availability. As regards the pricing, unless they really screw up, the only 'strange looking invoice you will get is possibly the first one after the changeover, as the change is very unlikely to coincide with your end of contract.

[#9]

@plusmouse 

As stated, when you order FF PN get a provisional date and time slot available to do the work. They contact you to agree a date and a time period (usually a 4 hour slot I think).

You new contract will start when FF goes live and the invloice following this date (unless it's already been issued by the system) will pro rata the two contracts.

Going back over the thread you need to be sure you've got a phone sorted for your mother first. Also, are you happy with the likely ONT location (beside your Master Socket) or do think you'd like it elsewhere in which case you speak to the engineer on the day to see what's possible.

Brian

[#10]

@plusmouse 

I note that most, if not all, of this thread appears to suggest that you are happy with Plusnet as as your ISP and intend to stay with them albeit on a Full fibre product. If that is so then you can ignore the rest of this post.

A couple of thoughts that broaden your choices. You may have already considered all / some of these and rejected them.:

1. If you speak to Plusnet COT they can probably move you to BT (on FF) and BT offer Digital Voice where you simply plug your existing landline phone into the back of their router. Useful if you do decide the landline is still wanted. There would be no downtime and no need to configure any VOIP. But probably more expensive than Plusnet.

2. There are other ISPs that offer digital voice solutions similarly but you would need to deal with such a move, letting them lead as gaining provider. If moving to FF you could get a new service installed in parallel with the existing Plusnet copper service. Unless you ported your phone number this would not cease your Plusnet service and you would be paying for both until you cancelled Plusnet. If you ported your phone number as part of the new FF service that would automatically cease your Plusnet service.

3. If you look around you will find other ISPs that do NOT impose mid contract prices increases on customers as the BT group companies and most major ISPs do. Some may appear pricier at first but not if you take into account the £3 increases imposed by Plusnet et al.

4. Do you know if any Altnets (such as City Fibre, Netomia (aka Youfibre) etc). operate in your street? If so the ISPs that use the Altnet FF offerings tend to be cheaper than similar Openreach based products. Some highly regarded ISPs are now using Altnets if available as well as Openreach. This link Browse Maps and Check Broadband Performance and Coverage Across the UK (thinkbroadband.com) takes you to a searchable map to see who operates in which postcodes in the UK - zoom in to your area and work through the yellow providers listed on the right to see which, if any, show a presence on your postcode area. If interested then visit their website to see what they or their ISP partners offer. Can be a bit time consuming as there is no way that I can find to specify postcode first.

Just a few thoughts. Whatever you decide, I hope it all goes smoothly.

[#11]

Thankyou again everyone. It`s good to know the cable just requires changing over via the existing router once the changes are made with the new ONT etc.... I just need to decide now when to call PN and discuss where I am and where I need to be if I stay with them for my BB and that`s likely to be the FF route and accept the 2 x annual £3.00 increases over the term of the 24 month contract. 

Or, look at BT Voice and retain the Home phone with them. I suppose that depends on price because BT will also increase the annual price and if the starting price is already more than I would be paying at the end of a PN FF deal (£32.99p) I could end up paying nearer £40+ a month just to retain the Home phone! 

@bmc : Yes, Mum has already said just to get her a mobile phone so that`s a work in progress. I gave her my old Alcatel Pixi 4 (no SIM inside) to use as a learning tool and she`s only managed to turn it on twice and is still getting her head around the `touch` screen and not to press it! 🙄 !! But she will need a 4g enabled mobile to actually use, so in the meantime, I`m trying to get her to play with the Alcatel just to familiarize herself with it`s Home screen which I`ve only kept the `Phone` icon showing and removed the other apps from the Home screen so she`s not confused. I let her use my Samsung mobile when I`m at home and dial the number for her and then end the call when she`s finished, but she needs to be able to understand the basics of having her own mobile and the confidence to use it if I happen to be out when she needs to use it.

If that goes well, happy days. 

@jgb : Thankyou for your ideas too, I appreciate that. The BT voice switch through Plusnet would be an option for us but I was with BT for many years and left them to join PN. I dread going back to be honest even though they are parent companies. And yes, their pricing is always that bit higher and usually rises as time goes by. I learned that the hard way when I used to be one of their customers. 

If I take the plunge and choose the PN FF option now, I will then be on FTTP so at some point in the future, I can switch between FF offers from PN or other companies without the worry over having the VOIP service `tagged on`. 

Does anyone know what is the best timing to agree a new offer for Full Fibre when still using FTTC and what the likely timeline might be for that changeover to happen? Meaning, if I agreed a FF deal and PN said we can arrange for an engineer to call on X date, does this depend on area and availability of OR people and how likely is it that this would happen within a week or two of agreeing the new FF deal? Or are they likely to give a random timeline until nearer my old contract ends? I don`t want my monthly price to shoot up to £50+ a month out of contract price while I`m waiting!! 

[#12]

@plusmouse 

In terms of price I don't think there's anything in it timing wise - a few quid here and there perhaps. When you place the order you'll be offered the next OR available slot. If not suitable you tell them when and they see what's available. Timing wise it could be a week, two weeks or even longer for the install date - it just depends on how busy the local engineers are.

I go back to getting a working phone for your mum first - that presumably has to be the priority and then order FTTP as soon as you're happy.

In future, if you decide to switch providers it is done remotely so can happen in a few days.

Brian

[#13]

Thanks @bmc . It`s the phone for Mum that`s the main niggle here even though it may take some time for her to `get it` mentally and turn the thing on every day until she does! I`m happy now just to get the FF switch in place. I`ve been reading some feedback on the BT VOICE thing and comparing that with what it would cost to run a mobile on a monthly rolling contract for her versus paying that bit extra to have the VOIP phone service instead and just keep that going But of course that would mean joining BT. 😲

It`s a case of moving on with a mobile or caving in and retaining a home phone, albeit a VOIP solution. I`m not too sure but I read something online where someone said that once your ON the VOIP system, you can`t go back? But I think they meant you can`t go back to the `old` ADSL or FTTC. 

Is it even possible to take the BT Voice service with FF/BB and then cancel the VOICE service at some point and retain just the BB connection? Or would it mean a totally new contract agreement? I`m not sure if these VOIP deals are flexible that way where if you take an additional service you can just cancel or change it mid-way through a contract or not. My feeling is that once signed up to it, your stuck with it for the term agreed. 

A little mobile sounds more like the best plan. Then I could just stay with PN. 

[#14]

@plusmouse 

Re the Digital Voice plans, I have one with Zen (having moved away from Plusnet almost two months ago). Keeping the landline for the immediate future was one of the reasons I chose Zen (like you I did not want to go near BT). Compared with the BT Digital Voice cost, the Zen cost is much cheaper at £6 per month for 1000 minutes to UK landlines and mobiles, and the Zen FF is at a similar cost to PN (albeit that Zen use City Fibre here which keeps costs down compared with their prices on the Openreach network). I just had to plug my existing Panasonic DECT phone base station into the Zen supplied Fritzbox router which came preconfigured to set itself up one plugged into the City Fibre ONT.

Basically with Zen I have two contracts one for the FF broadband, and another for the Digital Voice service. Both contracts run for 18 months with no in-contract prices increases.  Their out of contract rates are basically the same as the in-contract prices with an increase to match the current prices at that time (around a CPI increase I was told).You are correct in that I cannot cancel the Digital Voice contract without incurring termination fees which basically equate to the monthly cost but at the Zen cost I am not too bothered. I suspect the BT offering has the same "handcuffs".

Re your comment in your post # 56, as I said above, with Zen I have a City Fibre ONT and I could use this to switch ISP at the end of my contract provided the new ISP would provision their service on the City Fibre network. There are already many ISPs that do use the City Fibre Network. However, if I moved to another ISP that used another network, for example Plusnet on Openreach, I would need to have another fibre line put in with the attendant junction box (aka customer termination point) on the outside wall and ONT on the inside.  So, if you take up FF with Plusnet, you can switch ISPs with relative ease provided they too use the Openreach network.

[#15]

@bmc - Thanks for the information on ZEN and the differences. I posted a longer reply earlier today, hit Reply and the page went blank. 😣 So I`m trying again!

I doubt I would switch away from the OR platform at least, for now. I`ve resigned myself to staying with PN and opting for the FF rather than delaying it and just taking the 2 x £3:00 hits over the next 24 months.

I see the above as the simplest way forward until I have more time to research my options in the future because it`s all very rush, rush and knowing the landlines are being pulled at a later stage anyway, I don`t see much point in dwelling on that when the choice to get FF is open to me now. I just hope the changeover happens on time and I`m not waiting months for it to go live while paying an out of contract bill once my current contract final payment is made and the direct debit awaits the pricing change or rebates made. I know that can happen. 

I`ll update again once I`ve contacted PN options and spoken to someone. Because although there`s an offer to sign up to what I already have (FTTC + Line) for another 18 months in my accounts page, I`d rather jump ship now and get it over with. 

*Edited above to remove text.