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Billing notices

jelv
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 26,785
Thanks: 965
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Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Billing notices

giro: I've just checked my account. I received the notification under an hour ago and the invoice is already available in View Transactions.
The issue is have Plusnet already submitted this DD request to the bank and if not how long have I got to contact them if there is an error?
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£14.40/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: Billing notices

if  these entitlements are not met
as the  exclusivity of the contract is not with plusnet 
I will cancel any DD as I've been told not to make any further payments without
having the details in writing prior  to any collection of that  amount  from my account
as a breach of my contract , I will begin looking for a new provider
glloyd
Rising Star
Posts: 1,670
Thanks: 20
Fixes: 1
Registered: ‎06-04-2007

Re: Billing notices

I feel this thread has been high jacked to make threats against PlusNet. The purpose of my original post  was to try to sort out the problem of some accounts not being notified in advance how much will be deducted from their accounts not to start "I'll sue you"  rant by some people. Threats and ranting solves nothing, sensible debate may/will.
smiffyb36
Grafter
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Registered: ‎11-05-2010

Re: Billing notices

Angry
artmo
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Registered: ‎12-08-2007

Re: Billing notices

Quote from: glloyd
I feel this thread has been high jacked to make threats against PlusNet. The purpose of my original post  was to try to sort out the problem of some accounts not being notified in advance how much will be deducted from their accounts not to start "I'll sue you"  rant by some people. Threats and ranting solves nothing, sensible debate may/will.

Quite true glloyd, and as far as I can see the hijacking is by someone who hasn't got a problem - at least not an account problem Undecided
bobpullen
Community Gaffer
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Registered: ‎04-04-2007

Re: Billing notices

Quote from: jelv
How long is there between Plusnet sending the email and Plusnet submitting the DD request to the bank? This is the window the user has to get the amount corrected without them having to totally cancel the DD arrangement which is the only course if you use the bank's DD guarantee procedure (you can't stop a single payment).

The payment request gets sent to our intermediary at a similar time to the notification email being sent out. From there it takes 3 working days for the request to reach the customer's bank and for the funds to be debited.
Quote
Some time ago someone from Plusnet made a commitment to extend the 3 days - I'm not sure if it was on here on on PUG. I can't find it now. Sad

Quote from: Mand
As a further note we're looking into the DD notification period, with a view to making it longer.

There are no plans to do this during the next batch of billing system refinements. There /were/ but unfortunately the project has been de-scoped quite significantly. Thinking about it the only way I can see it being possible is by not submitting the payment request until several days after the customer's invoice date. This would be a deviation from the way the billing platform has *always* worked.
Quote
I also find it interesting that Plusnet's owners give the full 10 days notice!

Completely different code, completely different system.
Quote from: giro
I'm entitled to a final written detail bill monthly before any payment is taken
It must arrive to me in a time that if it has errors they can be disputed and the DD canceled at my bank
many banks ask for a minimum of 3 full working days from the receipt of a written letter asking to do so

And what about if you phone them, go into the branch or cancel the instruction online?
Quote from: giro
my bill is due to be collected from your DD agent on the 11th
are you prepared to send me a detailed final invoices for my phone and internet use  in writing included the final VAT amount s to my mail box
3 full days excluding weekends before the 11th of this month ?

This is not how it works. Your billing date is the 12th. You will receive advance notification of your billing amount on the 12th. We will then send a transaction request to our intermediary. Three working days or so after this (so around the 15th-17th), the request reaches your bank and the funds are debited.
Quote from: giro
I will cancel any DD as I've been told not to make any further payments without
having the details in writing prior  to any collection of that  amount  from my account
as a breach of my contract , I will begin looking for a new provider

You *do* get emailed the details prior to the payment being collected from your bank and we are not in breach of contract.
@glloyd, apologies if I've contributed to the hijacking of the thread, are you satisfied your question's been answered?

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Product Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

jelv
Seasoned Hero
Posts: 26,785
Thanks: 965
Fixes: 10
Registered: ‎10-04-2007

Re: Billing notices

Quote from: Bob
Quote
I also find it interesting that Plusnet's owners give the full 10 days notice!

Completely different code, completely different system.

I don't understand that comment.
I pay my BT phone bill by direct debit. From their website:
[quote=http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/consumerProducts/displayTopic.do?topicId=19353&s_intcid=con_intban_Phonecustomermodule_YA_viewbill]An easier way to pay
As well as saving you money, Direct Debit also gives you a choice of ways to pay:
Monthly Payment Plan – you pay a regular amount each month
Whole Bill Direct Debit – your bill is paid in full every quarter
And you also get:
Control – you have ten days to query your bill before payment is taken
Security – you're protected by the Direct Debit Guarantee
Automatic payment – you don't have to remember to pay your bill
jelv (a.k.a Spoon Whittler)
   Why I have left Plusnet (warning: long post!)   
Broadband: Andrews & Arnold Home::1 (FTTC 80/20)
Line rental: Pulse 8 Home Line Rental (£14.40/month)
Mobile: iD mobile (£4/month)
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: Billing notices

Quote
You *do* get emailed the details prior to the payment being collected from your bank and we are not in breach of contract.

i will check your  itemized  email items against  your total payment for charges against my acc
and as
the 14 th is a sat
the 15th is a sun
so when i check my monthly bank statement your DD withdrawal  from my account will appear  on it
dated the 17th true ?
if this is not the case - yes you will  be in breach of contract
bobpullen
Community Gaffer
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Registered: ‎04-04-2007

Re: Billing notices

Quote from: jelv
I don't understand that comment.

I suppose what I was getting at was the fact that we'd need to make significant code changes to our billing platform to align ourselves with the way BT operate. Without actually knowing, I'd wager that BT had things implemented this way from day one?
The decision for the notice period to be three days when we first started offering Direct Debit is something that pre-dates my time here so I'm not sure of the justification.
Quote from: giro
Quote
You *do* get emailed the details prior to the payment being collected from your bank and we are not in breach of contract.

i will check your  itemized  email items against  your total payment for charges against my acc
and as
the 14 th is a sat
the 15th is a sun
so when i check my monthly bank statement your DD withdrawal  from my account will appear  on it
dated the 17th true ?
if this is not the case - yes you will  be in breach of contract

By my reckoning it will be the 17th or later, although having said that as long as it comes out on or after the 15th I still don't think we're in breach of contract.
Edit: modified post to add preceding quote to my answer to jelv.

Bob Pullen
Plusnet Product Team
If I've been helpful then please give thanks ⤵

magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: Billing notices

It  can be  said as you refuse customers more than 3 days advanced warning of changes when the DD guarantee says alternatively
your also breaking the contract by failing to meet your own t&c 
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: Billing notices

Quote
By my reckoning it will be the 17th or later, although having said that as long as it comes out on or after the 15th I still don't think we're in breach of contract.

i will email this reply to both ombudsmans
glloyd
Rising Star
Posts: 1,670
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Registered: ‎06-04-2007

Re: Billing notices

Quote from: Bob

@glloyd, apologies if I've contributed to the hijacking of the thread, are you satisfied your question's been answered?

Not really Bob. Although I've never had any problems in the past (except when they insisted in rounding up my payment by 1p each month when I first joined) I do think it's only right and proper that all customers are informed how much is going to be deducted from their account be it DD or CC in good time so that any mistakes can be rectified before payment is taken. If mistakes are made they can be very costly and painful for the customer, as I found out to my cost with BT. Look at it this way - Would you go into a shop or restaurant and allow them to deduct money from your credit or debit card without first knowing how much they were going to take? I rather think not so why does PlusNet expect customers to?
If you pay your BB and home phone by credit card all you get in the email is we are going to collect the payment for your BB on such a date. No mention of how much and not even a mention of home phone. All you get AFTER the money has been taken is how much, you then have to log onto your account to see what you have been charge for.
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: Billing notices

and then cancel my DD for failing to give 3 working days advanced warning excluding  w/e
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: Billing notices

your attempting to cheat  customers  out of their  DD protection rights
magnetism2772
Grafter
Posts: 983
Registered: ‎06-06-2010

Re: Billing notices

I am going to email into  the FOS  and  OFCOM